markie
Joined: October 15, 2001 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 13178
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:00 PM UTC
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Originally posted by ggwâ?¢:
Well a Dane won in '96 and an Irish guy in '87 (is there altitude in Ireland) and plenty of Dutch have placed.
all winners have trained at altitude since the 60s. Although the use of EPO (erythropoeitin) and blood doping has reduced its importance.
Thats why there is a 50% maximum hematocrit level (red blood cells)
ggw
Joined: December 16, 2001 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 14237
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:05 PM UTC
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Originally posted by markie:
Originally posted by ggwâ?¢:
Well a Dane won in '96 and an Irish guy in '87 (is there altitude in Ireland) and plenty of Dutch have placed.
all winners have trained at altitude since the 60s. Although the use of EPO (erythropoeitin) and blood doping has reduced its importance.
Thats why there is a 50% maximum hematocrit level (red blood cells)
But not having a high altitude in your country is not a barrier to winning.
mankie
Joined: Unknown
Posts: 0
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:07 PM UTC
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Actually, I'm reading a book at the moment in which it addresses the training at altitude issue. Basically it's a load of bollocks. Yes you can train at altitude to get the body used to working efficiently with less oxygen by producing more red blood cells, but withing 72 hours of breathing at a lower attitude the body goes right back to were it was.
In fact, it can have the opposite effect than desired on many athletes, because you are unable to train as hard as you would at sea level so you can't push the body as much so the training is less effective.
Interesting…no?
ggw
Joined: December 16, 2001 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 14237
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:08 PM UTC
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Originally posted by mankie:
Interesting…no?
What? The stuff about the oxygen? Or the fact that you're actually reading a book?
markie
Joined: October 15, 2001 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 13178
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:10 PM UTC
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Originally posted by ggwâ?¢:
But not having a high altitude in your country is not a barrier to winning.
It is a help though. Especially if as Mankie pointed out your training can only take place around work.
It helps get you to a higher level of fitness, at the start, which then gives you a leg up into a team and the drug taking and the fame and glory.
There have been plenty of very succesful Columbian cyclists, have their not?
ggw
Joined: December 16, 2001 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 14237
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:20 PM UTC
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WHICH IS WHY ARMSTRONG HAS BEEN ABLE TO TRAIN FULL TIME TO BECOME WINNER 5 YEARS RUNNING. THANKS FOR PROVING MY POINT.
Europeans tend to be more into cycling – there are clubs and races everywhere. Not so in the US. Moreover, the number of professional cyclists (i.e., those who cycle full-time) is much, much greater in Europe than in the US. And sponsorships are far more plentiful in Europe.
All the above is traditionally true. Only in the last 4-5 years, as Armstrong has been winning, has the US begun to catch up. Nonetheless, Armstrong notwithstanding, the Europeans still dominate the sport and remain better equipped (sponsorship money, etc…). So I don't think I proved your point.
He has won five years running because he has been the best cyclist five years running – period.
markie
Joined: October 15, 2001 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 13178
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:32 PM UTC
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Originally posted by mankie:
72 hours of breathing at a lower attitude the body goes right back to were it was.
when I went cycling in Colorado and Calgary for 3 weeks I came back noticeably fitter than before.
If you keep training when you get back in the 72 hour period, well you can train harder than before which helps make you take a jump in fitness. Plus 72 hours is when it starts to go down, not goes down to its previous levels.
all professional endurance athletes train at altitude.
ggw
Joined: December 16, 2001 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 14237
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:39 PM UTC
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Originally posted by mankie:
Originally posted by ggwâ?¢:
[QUOTE
He has won five years running because he has been the best cyclist five years running – period.
You are forgetting the one big advantage he has…he doesn't have to worry about crushing his nuts on the seat! :D
I read an article that said there is actually a lot of truth to the notion that his cancer helped him get where he is today. First, it caused him to slim down – his weight had previously been a problem. Second, he could build back all his muscles specifically for cycling and endurance. And of course, there is the huge intangible of facing your own mortality and surviving.
markie
Joined: October 15, 2001 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 13178
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:39 PM UTC
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http://www.lancearmstrong.com/bio.html he trained at altitude and was originally a triathlete. Such competitions are rarer in the UK. (((The US climate (in some states) makes it easier to train)))
markie
Joined: October 15, 2001 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 13178
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 06:43 PM UTC
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Originally posted by ggwâ?¢:
cancer helped him get where he is today.
serious injury has seen many a rider come back much stronger…
laurent Jalabert and Marco Pantani came back after horrendous crashes and along break much better cyclists.
In addittion to your excellent points that time off may be recoverey time to muscles to fully heal.
ggw
Joined: December 16, 2001 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 14237
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 07:17 PM UTC
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Venerable Bede
Joined: October 16, 2001 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 3863
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 07:39 PM UTC
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i just found out that there's a team in the spanish league with my last name. . .too bad my spanish never got to this advanced stage where i'd be able to read the page:
http://www.villarrealcf.es/ and there's a pitcher for the arizona diamondbacks with that last name too. . .trying to get my sister to get a jersey from him.
Rhett Miller
Joined: November 15, 2001 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 17762
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 07:50 PM UTC
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There is an adult film producer/actor who shares my last name. I'll refrain from wanting his jersey.
Barcelona
Joined: October 15, 2001 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 1342
Re: Tour de Force
July 28, 2003 at 11:45 PM UTC
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Amstrong is joining a reduced group of cyclists, Eddy Merckx from Belgium, Bernard Hinauld and Jacques Anquetil from France, and Miguel Indurain from Spain with 5 Tours de France. I wish the attention these cyclists got in the US was 10% of the attention Amstrong gets in Europe.
