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Why, IMO, Tiesto sux

sweetcell
Joined: July 18, 2006 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 22608
Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 07, 2007 at 07:45 PM UTC #
Originally posted by bnyced0:
I'm just curious, with all the anti-Tiesto slaggin going on. What set of his have you heard that turned you so against him, which tour did you see that was so bad that just the mention of his name seems to send a few of you into slander overdrive? I don't think he's the best DJ out there, but I haven't heard one of his sets sound as bad as being portrayed here, but if there are some boots or personal reviews that reflect the complete shit that seems to be the consensus I'd like hear/read them because frankly I'm missing something…and I hate to miss anything.
i'm starting this thread in order to not clog up Just Announced.

i can't use your expression of having "turned so against him", as i've been unable to stand his music ever since i first heard it.

it's not one particular set or album that has him in my "must avoid" books. to me, his music is cheesy, unemotional, trite and formulaic (cue the hipsters who say "but can't all electronic music be described that way?!?"). i listen to a lot of trance, and his stuff doesn't even hold up as "introductory" - it's just plain bad. it's crass, commercial, lowest common denominator club/rave fodder. good electronica can have all the subtleties of classical/symphonic music. tiesto has consistently put out britney-equivalent bubble gum. technically impressive but completely lacking in content. on top of that, the guy comes across as a prick - huge ego.

all of the above IMO of course. based on his album sales and the number of fists pumping in the air during his coachella set, mine is far universal.
sweetcell
Joined: July 18, 2006 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 22608
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 07, 2007 at 07:52 PM UTC #
Originally posted by azaghal1981:
I just don't have much of a tolerance for hard trance/prog house. The beats are bland and aimless, the synth lines are as cheesy as it gets and the vocals (both when processed and when not) are laughably bad. And his dj sets pretty much consist of him pushing play and jumping around. All just my opinion of course.
funny thing is, i've never been able to place his music. it's not quite prog house, i'd say it's definitely not hard trance… euro-trance? post-rave? klub-krap?
bnyced0
Joined: March 02, 2006 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 894
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 07, 2007 at 08:31 PM UTC #
Originally posted by sweetcell:
Originally posted by bnyced0:
I'm just curious, with all the anti-Tiesto slaggin going on. What set of his have you heard that turned you so against him, which tour did you see that was so bad that just the mention of his name seems to send a few of you into slander overdrive? I don't think he's the best DJ out there, but I haven't heard one of his sets sound as bad as being portrayed here, but if there are some boots or personal reviews that reflect the complete shit that seems to be the consensus I'd like hear/read them because frankly I'm missing something…and I hate to miss anything.
i'm starting this thread in order to not clog up Just Announced.

i can't use your expression of having "turned so against him", as i've been unable to stand his music ever since i first heard it.

it's not one particular set or album that has him in my "must avoid" books. to me, his music is cheesy, unemotional, trite and formulaic (cue the hipsters who say "but can't all electronic music be described that way?!?"). i listen to a lot of trance, and his stuff doesn't even hold up as "introductory" - it's just plain bad. it's crass, commercial, lowest common denominator club/rave fodder. good electronica can have all the subtleties of classical/symphonic music. tiesto has consistently put out britney-equivalent bubble gum. technically impressive but completely lacking in content. on top of that, the guy comes across as a prick - huge ego.

all of the above IMO of course. based on his album sales and the number of fists pumping in the air during his coachella set, mine is far universal.
Ok, so for clarification when and where was the first time you heard him play and how long did you stay before it was obvious he was an untalented hack that didn't deserve to come within a mile of a turntable (my words not yours, but my interpretation of yours)? I guess I'm just trying to determine if this impression is due to being subjected to his horrible spinning, or more backlash against his status and annoying fan base. In otherwords have you listened or seen him enough to have such a strong reaction, and you can fill in "enough" based on how you assess other Dj's, bands, groups, genre's, etc. Your opinion is as valuable as anyone else's so I'm not trying to start a fight or stick up for Tiesto, but it seems like there's a gut reaction to dismiss him as "a hack that must suck or so many people wouldn't like him especially those silly europeans who wouldn't know talent if it bit them in the ass!" Again my words not yours.
HoyaSaxa03
Joined: March 22, 2004 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 7053
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 12:51 AM UTC #
tiesto is just the epitome of shitty cheeseball trance music listened to by e-ed out morons … i've honestly yet to meet someone who was seriously into cheesy trance music who i like/respect … in order to get into that stuff i think you need some personality traits that just don't mesh with me

and yes, i've seen him live … i was dragged to nation to see him 3 years ago
bnyced0
Joined: March 02, 2006 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 894
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 02:11 AM UTC #
Originally posted by Hoya Paranoia:
tiesto is just the epitome of shitty cheeseball trance music listened to by e-ed out morons … i've honestly yet to meet someone who was seriously into cheesy trance music who i like/respect … in order to get into that stuff i think you need some personality traits that just don't mesh with me

and yes, i've seen him live … i was dragged to nation to see him 3 years ago
For reference sake, what other DJ's are in the "shitty cheeseball trance music" genre, or is it an Army of one?
azaghal1981
Joined: June 17, 2004 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 12035
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 02:24 AM UTC #
oakenfold is an example of another.

Yeah maybe "hard trance" wasn't a proper use of words but I could see tiesto lumped in with prog house.
HoyaSaxa03
Joined: March 22, 2004 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 7053
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 02:59 AM UTC #
Originally posted by bnyced0:
For reference sake, what other DJ's are in the "shitty cheeseball trance music" genre, or is it an Army of one?
oakenfeld, paul van dyk, armin van buuuuren (although he has sick mutton chops)
<img src="http://www.wpclipart.com/US_History/presidents/Van_Buren_Martin.png" alt=" - " />

trance is fine if (a) you drive a pimped out hot pink honda civic hatchback, (b) you're on a lot of drugs, © you're living in 1998

it's just shitty, formulaic, boring music that tries WAY too hard at everything
bnyced0
Joined: March 02, 2006 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 894
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 03:46 AM UTC #
Yawza, pretty emphatic there. Well sounds like Tiesto, Oakenfold, Van Dyk donâ??t deserve to live, makes me wonder who are the REAL Djâ??s and what clubs do they spin at where you guys go dancing? Would Ferry Corsten, Fedde Le Grand, Carl C., Digitalism, Justice, K&D, Mauro Picotto, Sander Van Doorn, Miss Kittin, S&D, Richie H., Tiga, or Benny Benassi even be allowed near the booth at your favorite clubs?

The classical analogy is pretty accurate, as there is an artistry and subtlety to DJâ??n and the right dj on the right night can indeed change your life, but isnâ??t still pretty subjective? I donâ??t think dance music in general is mainstream enough to be called commercial in any sense.

A few truths IMO:

1. Any club that plays music you hear on the radio, ANY radio with the exception of some online stations, isnâ??t a dance club, I donâ??t have a word for it but it isnâ??t a dance club.

2. If you can sing along to whatever the DJ is playing, youâ??re not in a dance club, it might be something fun but itâ??s not a dance club.

3. You can dance (or at least try) to just about anything but a DJ IMO is someone that doesnâ??t play you music for mere listening, he/she takes you somewhere else, you donâ??t dance because you want to, you dance because you have no choice.

4. If they take requests, youâ??re not a dance club.

A dance high is one of the best feelings in the world and whoever can produce it gets nothing but respect from me, even if itâ??s not for me. But I suppose anyone who spins is fair game, just like any band that gets on a stage, for criticism and ridicule. Most people know what they like, and think they know what objectively sucks mostly because they donâ??t like it. Itâ??s human nature, and you really canâ??t argue with that, so I wonâ??t even try. Glad to see the club kids are fighting back against shit DJ's, the demons of hot pink honda pasts and the 1998 reference was classic. If only I could work in a reference to the Underworld, Shamen and 808 State and how they destroyed rave culture that would make as strong a point, but alas I cannot.


Originally posted by Hoya Paranoia:
Originally posted by bnyced0:
For reference sake, what other DJ's are in the "shitty cheeseball trance music" genre, or is it an Army of one?
oakenfeld, paul van dyk, armin van buuuuren (although he has sick mutton chops)
&lt;img src="http://www.wpclipart.com/US_History/presidents/Van_Buren_Martin.png" alt=" - " /&gt;

trance is fine if (a) you drive a pimped out hot pink honda civic hatchback, (b) you're on a lot of drugs, © you're living in 1998

it's just shitty, formulaic, boring music that tries WAY too hard at everything
azaghal1981
Joined: June 17, 2004 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 12035
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 04:42 AM UTC #
I really like a lot of the dj's mentioned in that list and could care less about others. They're all fairly different.


Saying "you don't like digitalism or Richie Hawtin?" in response to someone who doesn't like Tiesto is like saying "You don't like the White Stripes?" in response to someone who calls Nickelback a heaping pile of garbage.
sweetcell
Joined: July 18, 2006 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 22608
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 01:23 PM UTC #
Originally posted by bnyced0:
before it was obvious he was an untalented hack that didn't deserve to come within a mile of a turntable

(…)


Well sounds like Tiesto, Oakenfold, Van Dyk donâ??t deserve to live
etc.. etc… sheesh, get defensive much? :) chill.

you named DJs from a lot of different genres - are they all the same to you? personally - IMHO - don't freak out - i'm rather picky about what makes me dance. i just can't subscribe to "whoever can produce it (dance high) gets nothing but respect from me, even if itâ??s not for me". that's like saying you can respect daughtry and fall out boy because they "make people rock out, even if it's not for me". guess that makes me closed-minded, or maybe it means that my crap-tolerance meter is set too high. i fully agree that "a dance high is one of the best feelings in the world", and i'm not willing to cheapen the experience or take a second-rate substitute. YMMV. i have no doubt that many would qualify my ideal dance music as boring, trite, etc. i couldn't care less :)
HoyaSaxa03
Joined: March 22, 2004 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 7053
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 01:25 PM UTC #
wow, a lot of non-sequitors in here, let's see if i can make any sense of it

Originally posted by bnyced0:
The classical analogy is pretty accurate, as there is an artistry and subtlety to DJâ??n and the right dj on the right night can indeed change your life, but isnâ??t still pretty subjective?
yes, of course. i subjectively dislike trance music, many people (some of whom drive fuscia VW golfs) subjectively enjoy it.

Originally posted by bnyced0:
I donâ??t think dance music in general is mainstream enough to be called commercial in any sense.
um, that's objectively wrong.


Originally posted by bnyced0:
Yawza, pretty emphatic there. Well sounds like Tiesto, Oakenfold, Van Dyk donâ??t deserve to live, makes me wonder who are the REAL Djâ??s and what clubs do they spin at where you guys go dancing?
why are you so hung up on this? i never said these guys weren't REAL DJ's … they're just not my cup of tea

Originally posted by bnyced0:
Would Ferry Corsten, Fedde Le Grand, Carl C., Digitalism, Justice, K&amp;D, Mauro Picotto, Sander Van Doorn, Miss Kittin, S&amp;D, Richie H., Tiga, or Benny Benassi even be allowed near the booth at your favorite clubs?
i don't generally go to "dance clubs", and most of the electronic music i'm exposed to is second-hand through friends … i know one thing, however: i really really don't like trance


Originally posted by bnyced0:
A few truths IMO:

1. Any club that plays music you hear on the radio, ANY radio with the exception of some online stations, isnâ??t a dance club, I donâ??t have a word for it but it isnâ??t a dance club.

2. If you can sing along to whatever the DJ is playing, youâ??re not in a dance club, it might be something fun but itâ??s not a dance club.

3. You can dance (or at least try) to just about anything but a DJ IMO is someone that doesnâ??t play you music for mere listening, he/she takes you somewhere else, you donâ??t dance because you want to, you dance because you have no choice.

4. If they take requests, youâ??re not a dance club.

umm, ok? did you just paste this from a blog post you wrote or something? your "about me" on facebook? how is this relevant to what we're discussing?


Originally posted by bnyced0:
A dance high is one of the best feelings in the world and whoever can produce it gets nothing but respect from me, even if itâ??s not for me. But I suppose anyone who spins is fair game, just like any band that gets on a stage, for criticism and ridicule. Most people know what they like, and think they know what objectively sucks mostly because they donâ??t like it. Itâ??s human nature, and you really canâ??t argue with that, so I wonâ??t even try.
you're way off base here … i'm sure these super-trance-djs are OBJECTIVELY fine practicioners, SUBJECTIVELY i think they make repetitive drivel only consumable while on drugs or while you're OBJECTIVELY border-line retarded
bnyced0
Joined: March 02, 2006 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 894
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 01:44 PM UTC #
Originally posted by sweetcell:
Originally posted by bnyced0:
[qb]you named DJs from a lot of different genres - are they all the same to you?
No they're not the same, the beauty of dance music and I suppose any other genre is that there is variety and it can all be good within context.

I'm not a defender of "popular" DJ's and especially not of Tiesto, I just find myself interested in why some would go out of their way to slag a DJ (or a group for that matter) that they find too inconsequential to listen too or see live.

The bands I don't like don't even ping my relevance barometer enough to even think about them let alone go out of my way to insult, though admitedly I probably phuck with their fans alot.

I'm sure I share the psychology of being a hater, there are groups I won't listen to simply because I intesely dislike their "fans." It's illogical, but I know I do it, I suppose it's a relief to see it as pervasive in others as in me.

But it appears there are substantive reasons to hate any DJ from the Benelux that plays in front of more than 1000 people at a time. Works for me.
thirsty moore
Joined: January 11, 2000 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 6131
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 01:51 PM UTC #
TOO MANY DJS.
bnyced0
Joined: March 02, 2006 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 894
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 01:56 PM UTC #
Originally posted by bnyced0:
I donâ??t think dance music in general is mainstream enough to be called commercial in any sense.
um, that's objectively wrong.

OK, I'll bite. How is that wrong?

[/qb]you're way off base here … i'm sure these super-trance-djs are OBJECTIVELY fine practicioners, SUBJECTIVELY i think they make repetitive drivel only consumable while on drugs or while you're OBJECTIVELY border-line retarded [/QB]


You're undoubtedly my favorite 930 Forum poster, are you this good in court? Your billing must be amazing, the vitriolic way you embrace some of these topics is actually impressive. Seriously. But your sarcasm detector might be a bit off, and you might want to get it calibrated. I stopped being serious about this topic several posts ago, but it's nevertheless encouraging to know that there are so many ways for people to say something sucks. Inspirational actually.
HoyaSaxa03
Joined: March 22, 2004 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 7053
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 02:13 PM UTC #
Originally posted by bnyced0:
OK, I'll bite. How is that wrong?
there is definitely "commercial" dance music and "non-commercial" dance music, i don't think most people would argue that

Originally posted by bnyced0:
You're undoubtedly my favorite 930 Forum poster, are you this good in court? Your billing must be amazing, the vitriolic way you embrace some of these topics is actually impressive. Seriously. But your sarcasm detector might be a bit off, and you might want to get it calibrated. I stopped being serious about this topic several posts ago, but it's nevertheless encouraging to know that there are so many ways for people to say something sucks. Inspirational actually.
*** blush!!! ***

i'm just a lowly law student and summer clerk, and as it looks right now, i probably won't step foot in court or talk to a client for the first few years of my career
slappy
Joined: October 16, 2001 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 999
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 02:20 PM UTC #
Originally posted by bnyced0:
A few truths IMO:

2. If you can sing along to whatever the DJ is playing, youâ??re not in a dance club, it might be something fun but itâ??s not a dance club.
Wow! House isn't music for a dance club??? :eek:

You might want to educate yerself based on that statement. I think DJ's like Roy Davis Jr., Mark Farina, Armand Van Helden, Masters At Work have spun at dance clubs with people singing along.
bnyced0
Joined: March 02, 2006 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 894
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 02:28 PM UTC #
Originally posted by slappy:
Originally posted by bnyced0:
A few truths IMO:

2. If you can sing along to whatever the DJ is playing, youâ??re not in a dance club, it might be something fun but itâ??s not a dance club.
Wow! House isn't music for a dance club??? :eek:

You might want to educate yerself based on that statement. I think DJ's like Roy Davis Jr., Mark Farina, Armand Van Helden, Masters At Work have spun at dance clubs with people singing along.
Are we talking about music with vocals, or the crowd singing all the lyrics to every track being played? Knowing the lyrics to the random house track with vocals, would certainly happen occasionally but a club where someone is spinnin a set where everyone knows all the lyrics to the vocal parts of every track is either a set that is either too repetitive or represents a Dj that isn't earning his/her keep because I think that he/she should be breakin out shit that is fresh. So my over generalization is noted, but I stand by the statement that I don't think it's a dance club if those conditions exist.
bnyced0
Joined: March 02, 2006 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 894
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 02:37 PM UTC #
Perhaps a definition of "commercial" would clear this up. My definition would derive from commerce, and the sales of 12"s,cd's, mixtapes, etc being made by an artist, DJ, whoever. So most people would argue that dance music represents a large enough percentage of the music pie to be "commercial?" I can see there being cheesy, or not cheesy dance music. But I don't think the "cheesiest" electronic music makes a dent commercially through sales. But I could be wrong, wouldn't be the first time. Has there been a platinum dance album? Not talking about CC Music Factory, KLF, or even Chemical Brothers, but I don't think Oakenfold, Tiesto, or Van Dyk have sold 100s of thousands of albums, so I don't think their commercial, in the literal sense but perhaps commercial is a substitute for another more accurate word?


Originally posted by Hoya Paranoia:
Originally posted by bnyced0:
[qb]OK, I'll bite. How is that wrong?
there is definitely "commercial" dance music and "non-commercial" dance music, i don't think most people would argue that

[
HoyaSaxa03
Joined: March 22, 2004 at 06:01 AM UTC
Posts: 7053
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 02:42 PM UTC #
i don't know about in the states, but those mega DJs certainly have top-selling albums elsewhere
TheDirector217
Joined: August 02, 2006 at 05:01 AM UTC
Posts: 999
Re: Why, IMO, Tiesto sux June 08, 2007 at 03:01 PM UTC #
Originally posted by Hoya Paranoia:
i'm just a lowly law student and summer clerk, and as it looks right now, i probably won't step foot in court or talk to a client for the first few years of my career
For some reason, I haven't been able to stop listening to "I Fought The Law" for the past week. Aside of the fact that it RAWKS, you're the second thing that passes through my head. (I think you said it was your pre-test ritual.) Go Hoyas . . . .

*cues up iPod*
"Breakin' rocks in-a the hot sun/
I fought the law & a the law won . . . " :D
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