Originally posted by bnyced0:Please do, bnyced0. I look forward to reading your accounts of those shows!
Anyway I'm going to the Paris show and Pink Pop festival so I'll give a first hand account of whether this lives up to pumpkin lore, merely starts a new chapter, or not worthy of the name.
smashing pumpkins
Looking forward to the new record - Upset that it's not the original lineup…
Originally posted by RustyOrgan:"Upset"? Really? I never thought D'Arcy and Iha had all that much input into the SP albums anyway.
Looking forward to the new record - Upset that it's not the original lineup…
Originally posted by Darth Ed:i think that bands like this survive because of nostalgia…sure i remember when SP came out and my girlfriend at the time would play it over and over again…and wrote "pumpkins" all over bookbag and such….so seeing them would be ok cause it'd take me back.
Originally posted by RustyOrgan:"Upset"? Really? I never thought D'Arcy and Iha had all that much input into the SP albums anyway.
Looking forward to the new record - Upset that it's not the original lineup…
however, its not just hearing the songs…its seeing "them" play them…and without most of them it's just not going to be the same.
theres something neat about standing in a crowd as a 30 year old…watching some band and thinking…we all did this 15 years ago!!! like a re-union between the band and the fans….new lineups just cant provide that same feeling..in my opinion.
maybe that doesnt make sense, though.
No, it makes complete sense. It's a visual thing. Jerry wrote most of the good Alice In Chains songs but the band just isn't the same w/o Layne. Seeing Metallica would be 'off' due to Jason's departure. (I'm trying to think of more examples here…)
With Nine Inch Nails it was always Trent's band (such as Smashing Pumpkins is Billy's band) but visually SP have always been Billy, James, D'arcy and Jimmy while NIN has been revolving with every album (to some extent). Seeing Melissa play with SP at Patriot Center was a drag. Seeing SP play w/o D'arcy AND James will REALLY suck regardless of how good the new songs are. I'd still go see them but fuck V Fest and fuck the Police.
With Nine Inch Nails it was always Trent's band (such as Smashing Pumpkins is Billy's band) but visually SP have always been Billy, James, D'arcy and Jimmy while NIN has been revolving with every album (to some extent). Seeing Melissa play with SP at Patriot Center was a drag. Seeing SP play w/o D'arcy AND James will REALLY suck regardless of how good the new songs are. I'd still go see them but fuck V Fest and fuck the Police.
Originally posted by RustyOrgan:interesting age difference here, as some would say that metallica shows with jason were "off" due to cliff burton's absence.
Seeing Metallica would be 'off' due to Jason's departure.
Originally posted by thatguy:now you're really dating yourself!!!!
Originally posted by RustyOrgan:interesting age difference here, as some would say that metallica shows with jason were "off" due to cliff burton's absence.
Seeing Metallica would be 'off' due to Jason's departure.
my first metallica show…1989 with the cult…when i was 12!!! but that was with Jason..presumably the first tour he did with them?
Originally posted by le sonick:burton died in '86, and newsted joined the band a couple of months later. i think his first tour was to support …and justice for all, which would've been the one you saw. that was a great show.
now you're really dating yourself!!!!
my first metallica show…1989 with the cult…when i was 12!!! but that was with Jason..presumably the first tour he did with them?
i never got to see burton play, but i thought it was interesting how perceptions change over time. the guy called "newkid" for years might've been the longest standing bassist for the band, but he would not be part of the "ideal lineup" for most metallica fans from when i was listening to them.
Originally posted by thatguy:EX-PHUCKIN-ACTLY, forgetting Cliff is sacrilege and anyone doing so should be banned from any Metallica show in the future for saying that shit! In fact you just forfeited the right to listen to any Metallica record, and Hell being banned from the country shouldn't be out of the question, I almost blew a brain vessel when I read that.
Originally posted by RustyOrgan:interesting age difference here, as some would say that metallica shows with jason were "off" due to cliff burton's absence.
Seeing Metallica would be 'off' due to Jason's departure.
Originally posted by thatguy:yeah. i definitely wish i'd seen them play with Cliff.
Originally posted by le sonick:burton died in '86, and newsted joined the band a couple of months later. i think his first tour was to support …and justice for all, which would've been the one you saw. that was a great show.
now you're really dating yourself!!!!
my first metallica show…1989 with the cult…when i was 12!!! but that was with Jason..presumably the first tour he did with them?
i never got to see burton play, but i thought it was interesting how perceptions change over time. the guy called "newkid" for years might've been the longest standing bassist for the band, but he would not be part of the "ideal lineup" for most metallica fans from when i was listening to them.
are you excited for the heaven and hell show at MPP? i know i am!! haha.
oh and hey, sorry i didnt say much to you last friday, i was being grumpy that whole evening.
I'm gone during the MPP show, so I'm going to Chicago to see Heaven & Hell this Saturday, I'll give a detailed report.
are you excited for the heaven and hell show at MPP? i know i am!! haha.
[/QB]
And Dave, along with James, Cliff (after Ron left), and Lars were the Metallica line-up of my youth, while Kirk was still working out the kinks in a band I roadied for in highschool, Exodus.
do you have openings at the job you have that allows you to go to all these shows!! ;)
Originally posted by le sonick:I work for the man, you sound like you still have a soul left so I couldn't do that to you.
do you have openings at the job you have that allows you to go to all these shows!! ;)
I'm single and make the most of my weekends and vacation days, some people have other habits I have show obsession, just a matter of phucked up priorities and always chasing down that perfect concert experience. I'm a junkie and I know it. But when you get a night like RATM in Indio, or Soul Wax in Philly, or even Prince in Las Vegas it's worth every cent, jetlag, and other sacrifices for the cause.
Originally posted by bnyced0:i admire that! if i hadnt met my lady…i suppose i'd be doin the same!
Originally posted by le sonick:I work for the man, you sound like you still have a soul left so I couldn't do that to you.
do you have openings at the job you have that allows you to go to all these shows!! ;)
I'm single and make the most of my weekends and vacation days, some people have other habits I have show obsession, just a matter of phucked up priorities and always chasing down that perfect concert experience. I'm a junkie and I know it. But when you get a night like RATM in Indio, or Soul Wax in Philly, or even Prince in Las Vegas it's worth every cent, jetlag, and other sacrifices for the cause.
Originally posted by bnyced0:I feel your pain, fam. Was thinking about going to see Prince in Vegas, but I had to cut myself off. (There's NO way I won't gamble if I go.) And I flew to Hawaii to catch Pearl Jam open for U2, so who am I to judge??? ;)
Originally posted by le sonick:I work for the man, you sound like you still have a soul left so I couldn't do that to you.
do you have openings at the job you have that allows you to go to all these shows!! ;)
I'm single and make the most of my weekends and vacation days, some people have other habits I have show obsession, just a matter of phucked up priorities and always chasing down that perfect concert experience. I'm a junkie and I know it. But when you get a night like RATM in Indio, or Soul Wax in Philly, or even Prince in Las Vegas it's worth every cent, jetlag, and other sacrifices for the cause.
I think The Pumpkins should be straight, though . . . . With Jimmy & Billy, it should be good. Some of y'all act like D'arcy was actually a good bass player or something. Cool out . . . . . . :p
Originally posted by le sonick:
Originally posted by bnyced0:
Originally posted by le sonick:
do you have openings at the job you have that allows you to go to all these shows!! :) and can go wherever i want to see any band. if only i could have found a way to catch travis at GAMH or the fillmore wherever it was in SF. at least most bands stops by nyc :)
Originally posted by bnyced0:Funny, I caught Prince's set at the Rio last Friday. It was pretty frickin great.
Prince in Las Vegas
Also caught Interpol at The Joint at Hard Rock Saturday which was excellent. Good music weekend in Vegas.
Since that has nothing to do w/ the Smashing Pumpkins, I'll add that I never viewed SP as Corgan's band when I was a fan and viewed the chemistry of all four as necessary. I thought when he said he'd get the band back together he INTENTED to recreate the chemistry they had. Guess not.
That particular chemistry was lost long ago, well before they ultimately disbanded. When Jimmy OD'd, and they recorded and toured without him, and when Darcy ultimately found crack and free base more appealing than her electric bass the original SP was no more.
Since that has nothing to do w/ the Smashing Pumpkins, I'll add that I never viewed SP as Corgan's band when I was a fan and viewed the chemistry of all four as necessary. I thought when he said he'd get the band back together he INTENTED to recreate the chemistry they had. Guess not. [/QB]
Out of last 5 years of existence the original line-up only recorded and toured together about 25% of that time. So I can't imagine Billy, you, or anyone else expected that original chemistry to be rekindled.
It's seldom that even without the death of a band member that bands stay intact over the long haul. Even the notable ones (Slayer, REM, Pearl Jam, etc.) have had rough patches with a member missing for a while or gone completely.
It was always Billy's band, even if the input from others seemed substantial, we'll never really know, none of us we're in the song writing or recording sessions, but the general impression was Billy set the direction and the others added/followed. Based on what they've (other than Billy) done individually trying to stray from the Pumpkins hasn't been very beneficial.
Both Zwan and the solo album were intentionally trying to break away from a pumpkin sound and vibe, they were ok in my opinion but I think he knows what made the pumpkins the pumpkins and that he has deep cache of that particular inspiration left.
I don't seem him regurgitating that 90's sound, but won't complain if he does, Aerosmith and Mission of Burma took a ton of time off and came back strong, as did Echo & the Bunnymen, the jury is still out on the new Dinosaur Jr. but I think that true talent can overcome the huge expectaction the reemergence of SP brings with it. This isn't merely a reunion for a tour, but rather a continuation of something I found incredible and as long as the architect is involved I'll buy space in that building.
We'll see, I'm a fan with some blind faith, which is interesting considering religiously I'm agnostic.
ok, so i guess you could look at this like a second marriage for billy and jimmy and maybe it'll be for the best. that's something, and its cool folks are interested. maybe the new wife can actually keep corgan's ego in check, make him cool (not tedius) again and inspire him. i'm not betting on anything more than nostalgic background music to drink to, but anything can happen.
red flag #1: naming the album Zeitgeist. suggests the ego has not landed.
red flag #1: naming the album Zeitgeist. suggests the ego has not landed.
Red Flag #2: Putting them album out on 7/7/07, which is a saturday instead of the traditional tuesday indicates the ego has not landed.