No Baseball in DC?

Originally posted by pollard:
espn sucks

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2004/12/15/renteria_signs_with_red_sox_for_four_years_40m/

Renteria signs with Red Sox for four years, $40m
By Indira A.R. Lakshmanan, Globe Staff | December 15, 2004

Edgar Renteria signed a four-year $40 million contract with the Red Sox today, giving Boston an All-Star shortstop.

so, i guess the hanley ramirez bidding is to begin?? or do they move him to 2nd?

<img src="http://www.jesusoftheweek.com/art/j2k4-34.jpg" alt=" - " />

heh… I was just yanking your easily-yankable chains.

But seriously, I have yet to hear any argument for taxpayer financing of a baseball stadium that is not easily debunked. The only semi-valid argument I've heard is that it creates economic gain – but you would get more economic gain if you just put that money into directly rebuilding that area, rather than spending it on something tangential. That argument is like justifying the space shuttle because the space program led to pens that can write upside down.

this is a disaster and an embarrasment for DC.

Sorry, pouring tax payer money into more government kofi-annan type DC programs is not going to reinvigorate that or any other neighborhood.

Luring **business** to the District, and actual consumers who spend money that can then be taxed, THAT is the only way to fix what is wrong with the city.

This was going to be funded by a gross receipts tax on the largest businesses in DC. It doesn't come out of general revenue or anything else. It's not as though, without baseball, that money is available to be spent on something else.

Fact is, baseball wants to sell the expos/nationals, and they cannot do that if Linda Cropp adds $300 million to the team's price tag.

This was a win-win for the city and for baseball. Baseball could unload the expos. The city gets it money back, and more, because suddenly there are 20, 30, 40 thousand people from the burbs coming to ANACOSTIA for crissakes to spend money at least 80 times a year.

Baseball will now take its team to a city that understands simple concepts like investment and capitalism. The neighborhood where the stadium and all of its attendant social benefits would have gone, will remain a socialist shithole, congratulating cropp for sticking it to "fat cats" and whitey. The city is a joke.

Originally posted by HerrDoktorDoom:
heh… I was just yanking your easily-yankable chains.

But seriously, I have yet to hear any argument for taxpayer financing of a baseball stadium that is not easily debunked. The only semi-valid argument I've heard is that it creates economic gain – but you would get more economic gain if you just put that money into directly rebuilding that area, rather than spending it on something tangential. That argument is like justifying the space shuttle because the space program led to pens that can write upside down.

how is building a new stadium NOT directly rebuilding an area? how else are you going to get 30,000 people there 81 times a year? if you 'directly' put the money into anacostia, you're just going to end up giving breaks to other fatcat businessmen, although ones with a lesser public profile.

wasn't the area around mci terrible before they built it? i really enjoy going there, and the new stuff around chinatown is a big reason why. if mci was in the burbs, that would be alot less time in the city for me

yes, and credit to Abe Pollin for building the arena with HIS OWN MONEY!!!!!

wasn't the area around mci terrible before they built it? i really enjoy going there, and the new stuff around chinatown is a big reason why. if mci was in the burbs, that would be alot less time in the city for me

the same gross receipts tax was used to pay for some of the infrastructure for mci. not the same thing, but the district supported a fatcat there too

Originally posted by J'Mal:
this is a disaster and an embarrasment for DC.

Sorry, pouring tax payer money into more government kofi-annan type DC programs is not going to reinvigorate that or any other neighborhood.

Luring **business** to the District, and actual consumers who spend money that can then be taxed, THAT is the only way to fix what is wrong with the city.

This was going to be funded by a gross receipts tax on the largest businesses in DC. It doesn't come out of general revenue or anything else. It's not as though, without baseball, that money is available to be spent on something else.

Fact is, baseball wants to sell the expos/nationals, and they cannot do that if Linda Cropp adds $300 million to the team's price tag.

This was a win-win for the city and for baseball. Baseball could unload the expos. The city gets it money back, and more, because suddenly there are 20, 30, 40 thousand people from the burbs coming to ANACOSTIA for crissakes to spend money at least 80 times a year.

Baseball will now take its team to a city that understands simple concepts like investment and capitalism. The neighborhood where the stadium and all of its attendant social benefits would have gone, will remain a socialist shithole, congratulating cropp for sticking it to "fat cats" and whitey. The city is a joke.

ok. . i don't understand anything you said. . .first off, every dc-govt. run project is gonna be an embarrassment, and i agree. . .if there's a private financier who wants to build a team, great. however, the team will be sold, along with the stadium. . .if there's no stadium, then there's no way baseball can sell the team.

secondly. . how do you propose getting business to move to anacostia without a baseball stadium? with a stadium in anacostia, you have at least 1/2 of the people in attendence coming from outside of d.c., and d.c. finally gets to tax them.

d.c. general revenue is a sham. . all the lottery proceeds goes to d.c.'s general revenue fund, and not specially allocated education funds. . .wanna harp on d.c. not doing enough for schools, start there, not the stadium.

as for where the expos can go now? well, there are no other cities that have come up with a private financing option, and d.c. was the only one to even come up with anything remotely viable for construction of a stadium, public or privately financed. baseball cannot sell the expos without a) a home and b) a stadium.

so, i'm sorry j'mal, but each of your statements contradict each other. .you might wanna clarify what you are talking about, because i can't understand if you are for or against the stadium.

let's suppose they passed the same gross receipts tax planned for the stadium, but instead of spending it on baseball, put it in the general fund.

does anyone expect that the benefits from just another pile of money for DC's 3rd world government would outweigh the benefits from baseball?

——
(I think my post was clear. I am for the stadium and think DC's behavior is embarrassing. And baseball has plenty of cities willing to put up the cash.)

Originally posted by god's shoeshine:
the same gross receipts tax was used to pay for some of the infrastructure for mci. not the same thing, but the district supported a fatcat there too

not the same thing? It's not even close! "Some of the infrastructure for MCI" was stuff like sidewalk and Metro improvements in the surrounding area. Those benefit everyone. But Abe Pollin paid for the stadium himself with 100% private money.

Also, the whole city has undergone a development boom in the last 5 years… Chinatown would have developed with or without the MCI center.

The supposed economic arguments for the stadium are just as ignorance-based as Republican claims that cutting taxes increases revenue. It is not a matter of opinion: mathematically, it simply does not compute.

Originally posted by HerrDoktorDoom:

Also, the whole city has undergone a development boom in the last 5 years…

and why's that?

so you think that bringing 17-18 thousand people every other night to chinatown has NOTHING to do with the boom experienced there?

let's see, the city had the choice between —

a gross receipts tax that is paid back, to put a baseball team that could draw 3 million visitors a year to a bombed-out hopeless neighborhood,

or

fight whitey/fat cats.

brilliant choice. absolutely brilliant.

Originally posted by HerrDoktorDoom:
Also, the whole city has undergone a development boom in the last 5 years… Chinatown would have developed with or without the MCI center.

Do you honestly believe the huge boom in development is not related to the MCI Center being built and all that it brought (Jordan playing with the Wizards, WNBA, Hockey, Cher, Madonna, etc.)?

Originally posted by HerrDoktorDoom:

Originally posted by god's shoeshine:
the same gross receipts tax was used to pay for some of the infrastructure for mci. not the same thing, but the district supported a fatcat there too

not the same thing? It's not even close! "Some of the infrastructure for MCI" was stuff like sidewalk and Metro improvements in the surrounding area. Those benefit everyone. But Abe Pollin paid for the stadium himself with 100% private money.

Also, the whole city has undergone a development boom in the last 5 years… Chinatown would have developed with or without the MCI center.

The supposed economic arguments for the stadium are just as ignorance-based as Republican claims that cutting taxes increases revenue. It is not a matter of opinion: mathematically, it simply does not compute.

and bringing 3,000,000 people to a wasteland part of the district doesn't benefit everyone? its the same tax, that's close at least

DC's loss is gonna be Las Vegas's gain. Oh well, I still won't go see the Orioles play but once a year, if that.

wow, let me get this straight, some of you are now trying to claim that the *entire* DC real estate boom is related to MCI, and not just the immediate area? How much more specious can you get?

I guess the historically low interest rates and nationwide asset speculation frenzy, increasing traffic congestion in the suburbs, and the final removal of Mayor-for-Life Barry from the political scene had nothing to do with this?

Umm….. Marion Barry is your new councilman, if you live within view of the wasteland that could have been a stadium.

Originally posted by HerrDoktorDoom:
wow, let me get this straight, some of you are now trying to claim that the *entire* DC real estate boom is related to MCI, and not just the immediate area? How much more specious can you get?

That's not what you wrote. You said:

Also, the whole city has undergone a development boom in the last 5 years… Chinatown would have developed with or without the MCI center.

Frankly, no, I do not believe the same level and pace of development, if any, would have taken place without the MCI Center (and the new Convention Center) in that area.

yeah just what the world needs more chain resturants and a starbucks :roll:

Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
yeah just what the world needs more chain resturants and a starbucks

hey, hooters serves a valuable aesthetical purpose. ;)

regardless of what you think of chain stores, people shop there, which means they are bringing in tax revenue for d.c. i could do without chain restaurants though, especially fuddruckers.