Pixies fans

Originally posted by Sugartastic Tee Silk:

Originally posted by sonickteam2:
great info! i just bought the Coachella one, should be a doozy!

Have you received yours?

yes i just got mine the other day, number 628 of 2000, i just wish i was that close to the show!

THanks Seth!! We REALLY appreciate the info. Cheers.

The onsale date for Pixies tickets is Thursday, October 21, 2004…so we have a GOOD long while. Plus, they added 2 more shows at Constitution Hall.

And for any fans of disclive, you have one more reason to hate Clear Channel: http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story?id=6066617&rnd=1085585248450&has-player=false

How can they patent this?? Where's the patent in recording a live show and then burning it to disc? I bet it's all done with off-the-shelf equipment (fast cd replicators, blah blah). PLUS people have been doing this for years recording straight to DAT or MD and then giving copies to people. Clear Channel's threats sound ridiculous to me.

I wonder if anyone has a patent on cutting a steak with a knife. If not, I'm going to make bajillions.

Originally posted by bunnyman:
And for any fans of disclive, you have one more reason to hate Clear Channel: http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story?id=6066617&rnd=1085585248450&has-player=false

Originally posted by Chip Chanko:
How can they patent this?? Where's the patent in recording a live show and then burning it to disc? I bet it's all done with off-the-shelf equipment (fast cd replicators, blah blah). PLUS people have been doing this for years recording straight to DAT or MD and then giving copies to people. Clear Channel's threats sound ridiculous to me.

I wonder if anyone has a patent on cutting a steak with a knife. If not, I'm going to make bajillions.

PATENTS
How to Take the Concert Home
By SABRA CHARTRAND

Published: May 3, 2004

DIGITAL technology has put the "instant" into many forms of instant gratification. Instant messaging, instant photography via cellphones and instant-answer Web sites are just a few areas where people no longer have to wait for real-time satisfaction.

And now, in a growing number of nightclubs and music arenas, audiences leaving a performance can buy a CD recording of the live concert that is still ringing in their ears.

David Griner, 43, a lawyer in Austin, Tex., first dreamed of an instant recording in the early 1980's as he left a Bruce Springsteen concert wishing he could listen to it all over again in his car on the way home.

"The technology wasn't available to produce these recordings," Mr. Griner said recently. "Once CD-burning technology started to appear on the scene, it clicked and I thought, 'now we have the technology to do this.' "

Mr. Griner and his brother, James, have received the first patent for "creating digital recordings of live performances." Their process uses microphones, recording and audio mixing hardware and software, CD burners and a method of executing the recording and burning process to make it unique.

"It's the organization of the existing CD-burning technology that makes all this work," Mr. Griner said of his patent. "We record the show and do some minimal manipulation of cutting into the tracks, and whether it's on a hard drive or master CD, there are a lot of slave towers, and we pop it in and start burning copies."

"So as each song finishes, we start burning that song onto a CD," he explained. "So at the end of the show, we only have the last song to burn on each CD."

But the Griners' system is not the only one for churning out instant CD's for jazz musicians, independent bands and classic rock acts. Several companies are licensed to record live performances and sell the CD's to audiences immediately afterward. Some also offer them for delivery within a couple of days, and several say they have patents pending. The two largest use huge trucks to move their recording and CD-burning operations from venue to venue.

The Griner brothers have sold their patent to one of those, called Instant Live, which is owned by the radio and concert promotion behemoth, Clear Channel Communications. Like its competitors, Instant Live says about 20 percent of audiences are buying instant CD's. The recording industry says these audiences already spend $400 million a year on concert merchandise like T-shirts, posters and other souvenirs - so everyone is hoping the Griner brothers have hit on the next big thing.

But the Griners just wanted a way to amplify their enjoyment of their favorite bands.

"The genesis of the idea is that I'm a big live music fan, and always have been, especially for some of the lesser-known bands," David Griner explained. "With bands at that level, a lot of what goes into a concert and what you go to see can't ever be captured again. A lot of it comes across in what they say and do. It doesn't come out on the studio CD or live recordings. I've always been bothered that it was lost forever. I wished I could bottle it and carry it home."

He and his younger brother James, 40, an electrical engineer who lives outside Seattle, also wanted their invention to combat bootlegging.

"Bootlegs are less appealing because someone else gets the money, and the artist is not getting anything," David Griner said. "Especially for the people I go see. Most are starving to death anyway. So I didn't want to take away their money."

The Griners' idea did not take off right away. Early CD-burning technology was too slow to make hundreds or thousands of copies within minutes of a concert's end.

"The main thing was proving we could get the CD's out right after the show was over," Mr. Griner remembered. "We didn't think the audience would sit and wait for half an hour, which is what it took to burn CD's then.

"In 1999 and 2000, there wasn't a peep about this," Mr. Griner continued, even though it was possible to burn CD's by then. "But once burn speed got up, people started moving into it. That's the only thing that makes this commercially feasible."

The Griners' first working model was compiled from off-the-shelf recording equipment.

As the first batch of CD's is being sold, follow-up batches are being created.

Mr. Griner believes that Instant Live will also be able to use his patent to eventually make instant DVD's of concerts.

"The patent addresses video, too, and the technology exists to do DVD's," he said. "DVD burn technology is a lot slower, but I still think it can be done."

But technology has not been the only hurdle to instant recordings.

"As the industry took off, we found probably more resistance from record labels than from technological limits. The record companies were afraid they'd lose CD sales." Mr. Griner said, who disagrees with their stance.

"People who buy these CD's are genuine fans and they own every CD already," he said. He said he thought those fans would buy a live concert recording because a band might play an older, more obscure song, cover someone else's song say something original to the audience during the show. It's less like a concert T-shirt, he added, and more like a coffee table book from a museum exhibition.

"I think these CD's are more valuable to people who were at the show," he added. "If you were there you want to re-experience it."

The Griner brothers are not involved with Instant Live, and a confidentiality clause prevented any discussion of the terms of the patent sale.

"I always hoped that when this got put together, I'd get to go on the road with the Boss," Mr. Griner said, referring to the sobriquet that pop music fans have given Bruce Springsteen. "But I guess I'll have to buy my ticket like anybody else."

Even Mr. Griner's respect for pop stars has limits, however.

"I don't know how popular this would be at a Britney Spears concert," he said. "She doesn't do a lot of covers or unique songs, so consequently the concerts all sound the same."

David and James Griner received patent No. 6,614,729.

Patents may be viewed on the Web

atwww.uspto.gov or may be ordered through the mail, by patent number, for $3 from the Patent and Trademark Office, Washington, D.C. 20231.

NY Times

That's great news! About the extra shows, I mean.

Originally posted by bunnyman:
The onsale date for Pixies tickets is Thursday, October 21, 2004…so we have a GOOD long while. Plus, they added 2 more shows at Constitution Hall.

And for any fans of disclive, you have one more reason to hate Clear Channel: http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story?id=6066617&rnd=1085585248450&has-player=false

It still seems like a pretty vague thing to patent. I could see if they developed some software that would automatically do this or some specially invented machine but I don't see why their patent would be able to stop someone from using off-the-shelf equipment to take a soundboard mix and then burn it to a bunch of cd's. Is there a patent on releasing live recordings in general?

Phish's download system has been in place for a while and works really well (it's easier to get any show you want besided the one you went to). Plus the downloading technique works better for bands that play long sets. I was talking to my mom (who's into opera, which has VERY long sets) about how the company that records phish shows should do a deal with opera companies. They could charge lots more to sell them since opera tickets are so much more proportionally expensive.

Anyway…if i had the time to research it I'd be interested in who has patents on this stuff and how many different ones that there are.

SAT word of the day: sobriquet

BTW Bunnyman….where did you hear this news about the two shows added?

Originally posted by bunnyman:
The onsale date for Pixies tickets is Thursday, October 21, 2004…so we have a GOOD long while. Plus, they added 2 more shows at Constitution Hall.

And for any fans of disclive, you have one more reason to hate Clear Channel: http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story?id=6066617&rnd=1085585248450&has-player=false

Probably at www.pixiesmusic.com

I just went through that patent…it is pretty complex. I guess it's like patenting a non-linear editor or something like that. Still…there sure are a bunch of non-linear editors out there. This patent stuff is weird.

Anyone want to talk about American copyright law stagnating our country's creative output?

some of this was discussed yesterday and it would appear there is still room for innovation…

http://www.930.com/cgi-bin/ubb-cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=007080

Thanks Kosmo…looks like i was posting in the wrong thread! That's what I get for being a half-assed boarder. You guys already hit all the points I had.

From Pixiesmusic.com

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

MONDAY, June 14, 2004

PIXIES WRITE AND RECORD FIRST NEW SONG IN THIRTEEN YEARS "Bam Thwok" Will Make Its Debut Tonight via Apple's iTunes

OK, all of you Pixies fans, the moment you've been waiting for has arrived - the PIXIES have written and recorded a brand new song, the band's first in thirteen years, and you can get it starting at Midnight tonight exclusively on Apple's popular iTunes Music Store. "Bam Thwok" was penned by Kim Deal and produced and recorded by the Pixies at Stagg Street Studios in Los Angeles this past March. The 2:35 "Bam Thwok," with Deal singing lead, can be downloaded from the iTunes Music Store for 99-cents (http://www.apple.com/itunes/).

The music for "Bam Thwok" had its genesis in a chord progression that Deal had been toying with for a while, and the lyrics from an art book she found discarded on a city street a number of years ago while on tour. "From the handwriting, you could tell that this book must have belonged to a little kid," Deal recounts. "This kid had written a short story, a paragraph really, about a party that took place in another universe, about people and monsters that were partying together. That's what provided the inspiration for the lyrics." The song is a musical romp, and features a driving beat, searing guitar, and the whimsical chorus, "Love. Bang. Crash. Wakka, wakka, Bam Thwok." "It's a song about loving everyone," Deal added, "showing good will to everyone."

The Pixies - Deal (bass, vocals,) Frank Black (vocals, guitar), Joey Santiago (guitar), David Lovering (drums) - arranged and rehearsed the song at Santiago's home studio, which includes a 15-second carousel-esque organ solo performed and recorded many years ago by Santiago's father-in-law while he was doing missionary work in the Philippines. "That's a great piece of music," added Deal, "and it fits perfectly."

"'Bam Thwok' is a really good song," said Frank Black. "Recording it was a nice way for us to break the ice after twelve years. The recording process was very relaxed and it didn't feel like twelve years had passed."

As the Pixies are not currently affiliated with a record label, they had the luxury of making their first new song available to fans around the globe at a low price and instantaneously, something that iTunes could easily provide.

The Pixies plan to perform "Bam Thwok" at concerts on their current European and upcoming North American tour dates.

I already bought it at 3:00 pm today…so much for midnight!

any good?

Originally posted by Chip Chanko:
I already bought it at 3:00 pm today…so much for midnight!

Not bad…some good harmonies. It reminds me more of something off Title TK than a Pixies song, though. More fun and less energy.

Originally posted by Chip Chanko:
Not bad…some good harmonies. It reminds me more of something off Title TK than a Pixies song, though. More fun and less energy.

Agreed, Title TK was the first thing that came to my mind when I listened to it for the first time.

Not bad, but not great either. I hope Kim goes back to the Amps and Breeders's "Pod" music. That was really excellent music.

Yeah Pod was so great…what a unique sounding record. All the other breeders stuff I heard sounded pretty average to me.

Why are people down on Last Splash? I don't think it sounds average at all.

Originally posted by thirsty moore:
Why are people down on Last Splash? I don't think it sounds average at all.

I would choose Pod over Last Splash. However, I still think that Last Splash is an excellent album. Songs like No Aloha, Flipside, I just wanna get along, Divine Hammer, Saints, Drivin' on 9… excellent album. But albums like Pod or Belly's Star are just unrepeatable.

I'm not trying to dis their later stuff…but they set the bar really high with Pod.

Originally posted by Barcelona:

Originally posted by thirsty moore:
Why are people down on Last Splash? I don't think it sounds average at all.

I would choose Pod over Last Splash. However, I still think that Last Splash is an excellent album. Songs like No Aloha, Flipside, I just wanna get along, Divine Hammer, Saints, Drivin' on 9… excellent album. But albums like Pod or Belly's Star are just unrepeatable.