The 2020 thread....

Sïdehätch wrote:
I was shocked to hear that he represents a portion of Julian's America with all the gerrymandering going on

Its a real problem. As a compromise in the Julian's America Senate, we had to agree to annex Texas Oil Money to offset our annexation of the Maldives. The Eurocentric portion of JA was worried Asia was getting too large of a voting block.

Julian, wrote:

Sïdehätch wrote:
I was shocked to hear that he represents a portion of Julian's America with all the gerrymandering going on

Its a real problem. As a compromise in the Julian's America Senate, we had to agree to annex Texas Oil Money to offset our annexation of the Maldives. The Eurocentric portion of JA was worried Asia was getting too large of a voting block.

A+

this chant is the reason the dems will loose 2020
"PowerPoint, PowerPoint, PowerPoint,"

stollen-hätch wrote:
Joe…the right can't seem to stop talking about Hunter
…and some not so kosher international dealings in the Ukraine and china….what say you about these allegations

good news joe.
Ukrainian official knocks down Biden conflict scandal promoted by Rudy Giuliani

I love how trump was spinning this
Trump himself said on Fox News: "Sure, I’m hearing it’s a major scandal, major problem. I hope for him it is fake news. I don’t think it is."

I HOPE for him…what a disingenuous twat

I just got to say man that spreading far right conspiracy theory talking points in the first place is not a good look for you

Joe Biden might have some issues but come on…A powerful senator for decades and two term Vice President…I got to think he is pretty vetted by now

Anyways let’s see how the campaign evolves and remember that any democrat will be 100 times better than Trump

Have we learned nothing from the Bernie supporters that on the last go around told us Hillary and Trump were the same? How did that turn out? Just look at the Supreme Court justices that would have been liberal and think about how different America will be because of all the bullshit Bernie and his people peddled about Hillary

hutch wrote:
I just got to say man that spreading far right conspiracy theory talking points in the first place is not a good look for you

this Ukraine thing 'appeared' to have some legs at first glance

but lets not over-inflate the massive influence on the American voter that sidehatch has
I'm sure I've had zero impact on the 12 people on this board

also you have never heard this from me "Hillary and Trump were the same"
and I'm still not buying that Hill lost because of the misinformation campaign from the bernie bros

You do realize Trump won by edging Hillary in PA, WI and MI, right? Very few votes…it’s impossible to conclude anything other than Bernie’s continued campaign when he had no chance (past early March) did not have a big impact in the outcome…he tried out a lot of the attacks that Trump later used and gave them validity in the eyes of voters…And I am not saying you thought Trump and Hillary where the same but it did become a thing or is your memory that poor?

I think like 12% of Bernie supporters voted for Trump vs. like 24% of HRC voters that voted for McCain instead of Obama and he still fucking won! 

hutch wrote:
Have we learned nothing from the Bernie supporters that on the last go around told us Hillary and Trump were the same? How did that turn out? Just look at the Supreme Court justices that would have been liberal and think about how different America will be because of all the bullshit Bernie and his people peddled about Hillary

nkotb wrote:
I think like 12% of Bernie supporters voted for Trump vs. like 24% of HRC voters that voted for McCain instead of Obama and he still fucking won! 

hutch wrote:
Have we learned nothing from the Bernie supporters that on the last go around told us Hillary and Trump were the same? How did that turn out? Just look at the Supreme Court justices that would have been liberal and think about how different America will be because of all the bullshit Bernie and his people peddled about Hillary

24% of Hillary supporters voted for McCain rather than Obama?

I call bullshit.

Anyways it’s not just about voting for someone but about staying home cause poor Bernie got treated badly and anyways Hillary and Trump are the same. In a close election that makes a difference. Personally I think the country and world would have been way better off with HRC than Trump but how many times did we hear they were the same before the presidential election? If Sanders had dropped out in March Hillary would have won but his campaign kept peddling bullshit about how he could win while they got nastier and nastier…I remember his campaign manager making the argument in March- when they knew he couldn’t win- that the superdelegates should select Bernie even if he had less pledge delegates!!! They knew he couldn’t win but they were enjoying their moment in the sun and the huge money he was raising which made a lot of political consultants very rich so the incentive to keep going was there…unfortunately we know what transpired

Read it and weep, bud. Hillary's PUMAs were not a fan of Obama (way worse than Bernie to HRC): https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/08/24/did-enough-bernie-sanders-supporters-vote-for-trump-to-cost-clinton-the-election/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.badfa8f018f2

Hutch, your memory is broken and not working past 2016. HRC and Obama were WAY more fucking vicious to each other than HRC and Bernie.  Like, there are videos of this stuff…it's not a hidden secret or anything.  Hell, your girl even wooed voters by saying that Obama might just be assassinated.  Good summary here: https://www.thenation.com/article/the-2008-democratic-primary-was-far-nastier-than-2016s/

hutch wrote:

nkotb wrote:
I think like 12% of Bernie supporters voted for Trump vs. like 24% of HRC voters that voted for McCain instead of Obama and he still fucking won! 

hutch wrote:
Have we learned nothing from the Bernie supporters that on the last go around told us Hillary and Trump were the same? How did that turn out? Just look at the Supreme Court justices that would have been liberal and think about how different America will be because of all the bullshit Bernie and his people peddled about Hillary

24% of Hillary supporters voted for McCain rather than Obama?

I call bullshit.

But Obama won and Hillary lost so that’s on you and your Bernie folk


I assume you did everything you could to get Hillary elected once she was nominated?


I actually remember the Obama Hillary fight very well as I was an early Obama supporter and campaigned for him in the primaries

There was a lot at stake in the last election but many Bernie folk were generally adamant that Hillary was horrible and pretty much the same as Trump…seems laughable now but it happened

Anyways as I thought on Day 1 of the Trump shitshow this will be and is a rematch of sorts between Bernie and the more centrist establishment wing and Bernie folk such as yourself are doing the same thing to Biden that you did to HRC….you said yourself that Biden is responsible for every problem of the past 30 years!!


Anyways we know where we stand but I can tell you one thing: Bernie Sanders will never be President even with my vote but this has gotten tiresome

I can sleep at night knowing I took the Trump threat seriously meaning I thought he could win and did everything in my modest possibilities to get HRC elected

* sees HRC blow an election with MORE support from her primary challenger voters than Obama had from her, while losing 13% of Obama voters and neglecting key battleground states *

Bernie is the problem.

hutch wrote:
boring post that's too long and boring

hutch wrote:but how many times did we hear they were the same before the presidential election?

Let's get this out of the way …ZERO people on the board felt that way in November of 2016 (I can't speak for NKOTB)

there was a segment of independent voter that Hillary couldn't inspire in key areas…I think that is the problem and you non stop keep saying that someone else is to blame for Hil not getting the vote out in a few critical states…but it was also her election to lose.  We can go back and forth on the spoiler, but all she had to do is get 100k more votes in 3 states and we'd be in a different world altogether.
It is amazing that it was all about that
how Trump landed that hail mary will certainly go down as one of the greatest upsets in history


Trump didn't even believe he could win…I honestly believe he was hush hush about the russia stuff originally because he was like…'hey man this is the best marketing campaign of all time, The Trump brand will be worth 100 times world wide. It'll be tremendous  Me and my friends are going to be making so much money after this stupid campaign is over"

not that this will make a bit of a difference

Decade in the Red: Trump Tax Figures
Show Over $1 Billion in Business Los


10 years of tax information obtained by The New York Times from 85-95
The 10-year total: $1.17 billion in losses.



wait, can you say that a little clearer

While The Times did not obtain the president’s actual tax returns, it received the information contained in the returns from someone who had legal access to it.

grr…story will be derided on this sentence alone

I am bored but I don’t understand the desire to blame Hillary for her loss…blame the voters or Comey but she did her part…trouncing Trump in the debates…running a fairly tight campaign with many fewer mistakes than trump’s which was a shit show…he went through like 3 campaign managers…and then when Comey reopens the investigation the polls shifted and she knew it which is why she closed in PA

But there is no getting through to you on this…you think:
She lost by very few votes and won the popular vote by three million but ran a terrible campaign (beating him in debates and way out raising him and with Democrats running the better nominating convention by far) Comey influenced nobody, and she lost in a huge upset cause the TV talking Heads told you she was winning and you assumed she would

I am sorry but you have just bought into conventional idiocy…

I am tired of talking about this..

hutch wrote:
I am bored but I don’t understand the desire to blame Hillary for her loss…

it was her race to lose, that voters were swayed by comey or bernie, maybe, but her campaign should have tried harder…I don't know what the solution was…but she spent $1.2 Billion (and yes I will conced, she probably would have had closer to 1.5 bill if sanders had dropped out in February…but that's not what happened)
I think they spent their money poorly and couldn't convice people who supported her to come out and vote.
not sure why that is up for debate, but it is

but ran a terrible campaign

I never said that, but proof is in the pudding

she lost in a huge upset cause the TV talking Heads told you she was winning and you assumed she would

This I think is the crux of my argument…people thought she would win, so the didn't feel the need to put the jacket on and wait in line, what's the point, she's a shoo in

I am sorry but you have just bought into conventional idiocy…

why does it always have to end up with and insult to the other person
I've yet to attack YOU in my argument, but you often go in "trump mode" and insult others that 'they are soooo freaking stupid, how you be such a dunce to believe that, only a complete dofus would have that stance'
I guess that's your brand, but it is getting tiresome

stollen-hätch wrote:
Let's get this out of the way …ZERO people on the board felt that way in November of 2016 (I can't speak for NKOTB)

Yeah, I mean…I didn't like HRC, but I'm not insane so of course I voted for her.  Still, I do genuinely think that while, yes, she would not be as grotesque as Trump, in the long run she'd wind up being worse.  Trump is by no means an outlier…this guy is the pure essence of conversatism made flesh.  But if we had another 4 years of bloodless corporate liberalism, I really think that whatever came AFTER would be way worse than Trump. That's what gave us this guy in the first place.

hutch wrote:
I am bored but I don’t understand the desire to blame Hillary for her loss…blame the voters or Comey but she did her part…trouncing Trump in the debates…running a fairly tight campaign with many fewer mistakes than trump’s which was a shit show…he went through like 3 campaign managers…and then when Comey reopens the investigation the polls shifted and she knew it which is why she closed in PA

Her job was to win an election and she didn't win.  Who else is to blame?!?! If she didn't inspire people that don't vote to show up, or who voted for Obama but were leaning toward Trump, or to campaign enough in swing states where the election is really won, the blame falls on the voters? I mean, yes there are factors she couldn't control once the campaign was in swing (the fact that Republicans have hated her with a passion for almost 30 years, the fact that she was under FBI investigation even if it was for a nothing reason, the fact that she's tied to Bill's bad record, etc.), but like…maybe don't put all of energy behind someone with so much baggage?

hutch wrote:
She lost by very few votes and won the popular vote by three million

I think this is the rub of it…she got more votes than the guy she ran against. It's just that she didn't get them where it mattered. I get that it's a dumb system, but hey, those are the rules and if you're not campaigning to get votes where they do matter, I don't see how the fault lies anywhere but with her and her campaign.

nkotb wrote:
the fact that she's tied to Bill's bad record, etc.

Bill Clinton had the best Presidency of my lifetime and top 3-5 all time. He literally teabags Obama by every measure except how he made millennials feel as he passed virtually none of his agenda.

Julian, wrote:
Bill Clinton had the best Presidency of my lifetime and top 3-5 all time.

well I guess there is room on Mt Rushmore then…that's a bit hyperbolic IMO

He literally teabags Obama by every measure except how he made millennials feel as he passed virtually none of his agenda.

I really don't know if the first part is true, but don't have the facts to back my argument

but the second…that is true
GOP has been a master at messaging…to their base and setting the agenda on so many topics. 
They are the propaganda masters and Libs just whine and fight with each other

nkotb wrote:Still, I do genuinely think … in the long run she'd wind up being worse.
But if we had another 4 years of bloodless corporate liberalism, I really think that whatever came AFTER would be way worse than Trump.

dude, please pass that joint, because you are high as shit if you believe that…definitely helping Hutch's case with that argument